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SECOND
AMENDMENT
COALITION
OF MISSOURI
Here is the text of testimonies given by SACMO's president
Testimony to the “Pensions and General Law Committee”, 04/08/03
By Dale A. Schmid, president, The Second Amendment Coalition of Missouri, Inc.
In regards to HS HCS HB 349, 120, 136 and 328
Dear Members of the Committee:
Let me start by stating that the Second Amendment Coalition of Missouri, Inc. supports the passage of HS HCS HB 349, License of Carry (LTC) concealed weapons legislation and we have done so for the last 13 years. During this time there has been so much written and spoken against the passage of LTC by the opposition with so little basis of fact behind that opposition that it is disturbing. The latest has been the piece published in last weekends Kansas City Star.
In it the author “quotes” some raw FBI statistics about the reduction in violent crimes. Immediately after that she launches into the usual harangue about who is or is not a sane responsible person and how they can become insane in fits of passion and about people being released from mental institutions and cut backs in community psychiatric services and “Is it a service to give these people greater access to handguns?” She conveniently ignores the fact that this legislation has nothing to do with buying or owning or access to anything including handguns. The legislation is about setting up a system whereby qualified adults, after a long, exhaustive and expensive process can receive a permit to carry a handgun which they would either already legally own or in the future have to purchase through another long and involved process.
In this piece the author throws in the usual, almost obligatory, references to police concerns, frustrated teenagers and curious children. These are subjects that have been “cussed and discussed” so many times before in committees of the house and senate that it makes one wonder if the author is new to the LTC discussion. With so much obfuscation and lack of creditable information on the part of the opponents to LTC that I thought it might be refreshing to provide another report carried by the Kansas City Star just a few years ago. In this piece the author is none other than Doctor John Lott from the University of Chicago, the noted author, lecturer and researcher who’s study on concealed carry laws throughout the United States is THE definitive work on the subject of License To Carry.
Dr. Lott states that his research shows, among other things, that LTC laws don’t increase accidents, don’t increase suicides and “The more people obtain permits over time, the more violent crime rates decline.” For the convenience of the committee, I have attached the entire article from the Star. click here to read the article
For the sake of time and space, I’d like to point out some items that don’t seem to be in dispute.
1. No one have has ever shown and seldom suggests that crime will go up if LTC passes.
2. No one denies that 31 states plus, now, New Mexico and Colorado already have passed
nondiscriminatory LTC plus 12 other states have lesser forms of LTC available to citizens. In some cases, available for over 65 years like in New Hampshire, Indiana and for over a lifetime in Vermont.
3. No one has ever stated or shown that any of these other states have had such a bad experience that attempts have been made to either tighten or repeal the LTC law.
4. No one has ever shown that a permit holder has killed a police officer or even shot
at a police officer.
5. No one can point to an incident where a fender bender has resulted in an angry permit holder shooting up the place.
6. The disturbing truth is that the opponents of LTC, in all their presentations and writings, always assume that there are NO benefits, in any way shape or form, from the passage or the existence of LTC laws. That very assumption, the basis of most of the arguments against LTC, is false.
Reasonable, thoughtful people should be able to look
at the historically successful existence of License to Carry laws now in place
around the country and conclude that it is time, past time, to pass LTC in
Missouri. Please vote to pass HS
HCS HB 349.
Thank you.
Dale A. Schmid
Address to Crime Prevention and Public Safety Committee, Mo. State House, 02/18/03
By Dale A. Schmid, President
The Second Amendment Coalition of Missouri, Inc.
I’d like to offer my “Thanks” to Rep. Crawford, Rep. Barnitz, Rep. Munzlinger and the other authors and sponsors of HB 120, 136, 349 and the many other License to Carry (LTC) proposals and bills over the last 12 years. Also thanks to Rep Mayer, the Chairman of this committee for holding this hearing.
There are some who would think that these Representatives are going against the grain and are in danger of being not “politically Correct” with the reintroduction of License to Carry proposals. On the contraire, when compared to the rest of the United States, they are very “main stream” and very “P. C”. I have been coming to Jefferson City for 12 years, before house and senate committees, trying my best to help us pass some form of LTC. In those 12 years, at least 16 other states have passed LTC laws, most, if not all, even more liberal, lenient or easier to obtain than this one before us today.
There is great danger in breaking new ground,
exploring new territory, going it alone or “going where no man has gone
before”. The point man on patrols
always stumbled into danger before the rest of the guys.
There is great comfort in the “regular”, the normal and the tried and true. It is safer by far to follow successful leaders, whether they are individuals, organizations or other states. Many of the new members of this body are under the impression that LTC legislation is something new, and therefore dangerous. Nothing could be further from the truth. Take comfort in this fact.
There are 32 states that have “shall issue” LTC laws in place. “Shall Issue” meaning that if the applicant meets and passes all the requirements as stated in the law, that person shall be issued a permit without any “good ole boy” spins or sudden arbitrary or capricious behavior on the part of beaucrates. New Hampshire initiated their law in 1928. Indiana started theirs over 60 years ago. Vermont has not had regulations against carrying concealed, ever. No permit even required. Florida started their unified, statewide shall issue law in 1987 amid jabs by the St. Louis Post Dispatch about turning into the “gun shine state”. Any one afraid to go to Disney Land? Anyone afraid to go to the Indianapolis 500? Anyone afraid to go to Vermont? Texas? Arizona? Tennessee? Alabama? And on and on and on. 32 States are way ahead of Missouri.
In addition, there are 12 other states, like Iowa, that have “May Issue” laws in which one has to show need and convince the chief of police or someone else before getting a permit. That often times means the politically connected or wealthy elite can get a permit and “poor people need not apply”. Some of those states are very restrictive, like California and New York. They have a system but you can pretty much forget about a permit until you are already dead.
And so, the leaders of our state should take comfort in this knowledge. Pick up the phone and call the various agencies of the other states and ask them yourself if what I have just told you is true. Ask them yourself if there is death on every street corner or if everyone and absolutely everybody is carrying guns or if cops are dying like flies over simple traffic stops. That is what we have been led to believe by the opposition over the years.
To sum up this main point, I’d like to point out that no state has ever repealed their LTC law or even made it more restrictive, once passed. That speaks volumes and should be kept firmly in mind when you hear from the opposition about how terrible things will be should this bill pass into law. People who obtain permits to carry concealed weapons are not causing problems. On the contrary, as a population, LTC holders have been shown to be one of the most law abiding and least trouble making.
There is another angle that has always troubled me about this debate over LTC. The opposition always leads us to believe that there is unquestionably no good side to having a LTC law in Missouri. Unquestionably, in their warped view, passage of this law must be all bad and with absolutely no up side. Well, we all know that that is not true. There are many positive aspects of firearms being carried by honest citizens.
But the truth of the matter is that it is sometimes difficult to prove a negative, that is, to prove that something did not happen because of some other influence. For example, we all know that in our current media there is an axiom, which says, “If it bleeds, it leads!” Excitement and violence sells newspapers and creates Pulitzer prizes. Rape, robbery and murder averted will not often make the news. In fact, if an honest citizen does use a gun to stop a crime it is almost assured that the positive aspect of having a gun in the right hand at the right time WILL NOT MAKE THE NEWS! Witness the vice principal of a high school who ran to his car, retrieved his gun and held the young gunman until the police arrived. One small account in the very local newspaper was all that it got. What the national news wanted was another school shooting and they didn’t get it because of the positive effects of a gun in the right hands. The public consciousness did not get the benefit of that event. Our public officials did not get to learn from that event because it was not newsworthy in the media’s opinion. All we are treated to on the news are the worst aspects of gun usage, seldom the positive benefits and the consequence is a tilted, biased view against guns in private hands. But there is great research showing the truth.
In his ground breaking, peer reviewed research on carrying concealed weapons laws covering a 17 year time period and using data from all 3000 plus counties in the U.S., Dr. John Lott stated that if those states which did not have a LTC law in place in 1992, did have it, there would have been 60,000 fewer robberies, 1500 fewer murders and 4000 fewer rapes while at the same time saving those states 5.74 billion dollars in associated costs. Additionally, Prof. Gary Kleck’s research indicates that there are approximately two and one half million acts of gun self defense annually in the U. S. but that in about 98% of those acts, the gun is not discharged. He states that just the act of brandishing the gun was enough to stop the attack. However, in the view of most of the media and the anti-gunners, those acts of self-defense don’t count for anything. “Ho Hum! So what.”
“If it doesn’t bleed then it doesn’t lead.”
And now just a little antidotal evidence to ponder. All my life I have heard stories on the news about the “office duty police officer” that thwarted a crime. I’ll bet that I have heard at least a dozen different versions of this and I’ll bet that you have too. “Off duty police officer interrupts attempted rape” or “off duty police officer saves man from mugging” and so on. Have you ever wondered what it was that gave this “off duty police officer” this superman like ability to do these wonderful things? What was it that enabled this “doughnut eating, little pot bellied, loosing his hair, didn’t sleep too well last night, kind of middle aged, worried about the kids and spouse, dressed in blue jeans and tee shit otherwise average looking guy” the encouragement, security and peace of mind to single-handedly enter into a fray of some kind. Was it because of his unusual physical conditioning or training or that he knew that the perpetrator’s legs were going to turn to jelly and his hands were going to shake when the off duty cop flashed his badge? I don’t think so. I believe it was because the cop carried a concealed weapon and knew that if he started to get into real trouble or thought that he might get hurt, he could always pull his gun and that would be the great equalizer. I further believe that similar benefits would extend into the private sector through LTC legislation like that before this committee tonight. A legally concealed weapon on the person of a licensed honest adult could discourage or stop many crimes and make us all a degree safer from criminals and terrorists. For the off duty police officer, it’s easier to be heroic with a gun than without one. For the private citizen, it is often better and safer to have the means of self-defense available to him than have to depend on either society or the good graces of criminals.
There is an absolutely huge body of data, facts and figures about the positive benefits of LTC throughout the many states compiled over many decades of actual experience and history. It shows that LTC laws cause no harm, cost the state nothing and occasionally does some good. So, take comfort. Pass this bill. It’s the right thing to do.